Observation 109052: Scleroderma Pers.
When: 2012-09-08
Herbarium specimen reported
0 Sequences

Proposed Names

5% (4)
Recognized by sight
22% (4)
Recognized by sight

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Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus


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By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2012-09-11 13:39:02 CDT (-0400)

5 × 5.5cm! Close to 2 inches across the top. I’m getting good at this guessing thing.

By: AmatoxinApocalypse (AmatoxinApocalypse)
2012-09-10 23:34:04 CDT (-0400)

5cm x 5.5cm at the top.

2cm at the narrowest point of the base.

4cm from base to top.

I cannot find my ex-wife’s sowing tape measure to take better measurements, I am in the process of moving so have my KOH, tape measures, and microscope packed so I cannot be more help.

By: AmatoxinApocalypse (AmatoxinApocalypse)
2012-09-10 22:47:37 CDT (-0400)

Yes I was just about to update this find, I went back to the area and I don’t know if that last photo is a different fungi or not, but I am sure some of you would know. They were growing side by side with the larger specimens in the first pics.

I took some more pics today of the few small ones that were growing next to the big ones that were mature. I will make a new observation with those though.

Also the fungi has not shrunk to much with drying to I am taking measurements now.

I see the confusion now.
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2012-09-10 13:18:57 CDT (-0400)

Your last photo is of an immature fungus, T.A.K. It has a very small base, a 3-5mm thick peridium, no columella or pseudocolumella, and has no visible mature spore mass. It is loculate. It also has no reference to the rest of your photos. I would suggest deleting just the last photo, and adding it as a separate observation. It clearly is a different species. It looks to be an immature Rhizopogon species to me.

Could we also get a size on the original sporocarps? Based on the Loblolly pine needle, I’d estimate 2 inches diameter?

scope. trees, smell
By: AmatoxinApocalypse (AmatoxinApocalypse)
2012-09-10 11:54:40 CDT (-0400)

I just got a scope not that long ago, I need slides for it then I can really get down to business.

Thanks for the info guys, your posts have taught me a lot.

The type of trees nearby were ash, oak, loblolly pine, and a few more I did not recognize right off bat.

The odor reminded me of fresh potatoes, not a strong odor, slightly fungoid.

Not Scleroderma.
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2012-09-10 07:15:47 CDT (-0400)

Lacks a sterile base and multiple interwoven rhizomorphs composing the pseudostipe. Therefore cannot be Scleroderma.

Your obs. of Scleroderma cepa group at http://mushroomobserver.org/52922?q=buim is immature. It also has two sporocarps which have grown together from the same base. A very common feature of immature Scleroderma is the maturity of the interior of the sporocarp before the gleba near the peridium. In other words, the gleba matures from the inner-most portion outward, with the section near the peridium developing last.

It is either a columella or pseudostipe. Similar to Endoptychum. It is irregular, with at least one side branch. Said branch is thick and ropey. The columella does not separate as your example above. It has not grown together from a common base. There is no base present in the obs.

This obs. has many of the features found in Imaia gigantea, which is known from North Carolina and Tennessee of the Appalachian Mtns, but differs from I. gigantea. The peridium is too thick. Imaia similarly lacks an internal columella.

Microscopic examination of the peridium can assist identification. The lack of sterile base precludes Scleroderma.

A most interesting collection. I look forward to seeing spore microscopy.

By: A. Cortés-Pérez (Alonso)
2012-09-10 02:32:54 CDT (-0400)

The hyphae of the peridium can help. If these have clamp connection is a basidiomycete, Scleroderma. But if not present may be an ascomycete

By: A. Cortés-Pérez (Alonso)
2012-09-10 02:26:37 CDT (-0400)

That’s not a columella. The gleba is immature, which seems columella is but an abnormal growth of the fungus. I do not see any green tone in the gleba. Most species of Scleroderma when immature exhibit gleba loculate and finally dusty. This observation is similar to this http://mushroomobserver.org/52922?q=buim, just try to be different species.

Contact Dr. Brenniman at
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2012-09-09 08:45:09 CDT (-0400)

Dr. Tim Brenneman
Dept. of Plant Pathology
University of Georgia
P.O. Box 748 Rainwater Road
Tifton, GA 31793

I worked with him several years ago in regard to Tuber lyonii, which is also found in Georgia (and almost anywhere else with pecan trees).

The gleba of this obs. is dark green, which eliminates all known Scleroderma from consideration in my opinion. The gleba does not appear to be loculate.

But to confirm what it is will now require microscopy. Dr. Brenniman could assist with that.

Branching columella
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2012-09-09 08:33:13 CDT (-0400)

is an important diagnostic for identification. Scleroderma can be eliminated by enlarging the photo to large or huge, and examining the gleba. Gleba is not powdery. No Scleroderma has a branching columella. Indeed, this is the first example of that that I have seen outside of Truncolumella. Nor is this Truncocolumella, which autodeliqueces in age, forming a gooey mass of liquified spores within a persistent papery peridium.

By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2012-09-08 20:04:02 CDT (-0400)

This is NOT a Scleroderma. Scleroderma does not have a columella or pseudocolumella.

Needs microscopy. Possibly an ascomycete.

Probably will need to get a voucher collection to Dr. Matt Trappe at Oregon State University, in care of North American Truffling Society. Need to send him the photos first.

This looks similar to Imaia but with atypical features. Imaia gigantea is known from the Appalachian Mtns. of Tennessee and North Carolina, but lacks a columella/pseudocolumella. Imaia gigantea known to fruit from September thru October, so may be found some time into the future as well.

Need to prove, if possible the host for this species. Please take detailed photos of any nearby (within 150 feet from collection site) of any tree or shrub species.

Also, need to document any odor either/or fresh or current; now or from future collection.

Magnificent collection! Need as much data as you can collect regarding it, including GPS coordinates.

sounds right
By: Danny Newman (myxomop)
2012-09-08 06:07:14 CDT (-0400)
By: AmatoxinApocalypse (AmatoxinApocalypse)
2012-09-08 06:00:48 CDT (-0400)

This thing is very hard, just a little bit spongy, but very firm.

Its really very beautiful.

Created: 2012-09-08 05:49:53 CDT (-0400)
Last modified: 2012-09-10 02:12:09 CDT (-0400)
Viewed: 222 times, last viewed: 2017-09-22 17:05:25 CDT (-0400)
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