Observation 129700: Gymnopilus P. Karst.

When: 2003-12-14

Collection location: Braga, Portugal [Click for map]

Who: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)

No specimen available

Under conifers, on the ground.

Proposed Names

11% (3)
Recognized by sight: In this group it is necessary to do microscopy before applying a species name
28% (5)
Recognized by sight: Gymnopilus penetrans is said to have a smooth (glabrous) pileus.

Please login to propose your own names and vote on existing names.

Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus


Add Comment
By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2014-03-04 10:37:13 PST (-0800)

the first line under “Observations” in Hesler’s monograph of the genus states, about G. penetrans…

“The distinctive characters of this species include a pileus which is glabrous…”

it is the first sentence!!

but i guess those who voted “i’d call it that” are more knowledgeable of the genus than Murrill (who described the species), Hesler and LG.

Irene posted a bunch of information about micro characteristics…and this observation shows NONE!!

By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2014-03-04 10:28:08 PST (-0800)

it does not…
and i am by no means disregarding this observation.
however, to claim it be, without a doubt G. penetrans…is just ridiculous.
we don’t even know what G. pentrans is…exactly.
it would take uncontroversial DNA evidence that matches the type to “call it that.”

Holec has no right or evidence to support his description of G. penetrans.

By: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)
2014-03-04 10:24:18 PST (-0800)

I do not want to intrude in the discussion, because I have no knowledge to do so. Just wanted to ask if the last picture does not show the veil in the stem?

i find it funny…
By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2014-03-04 10:02:16 PST (-0800)

that not only was this observation found growing on the ground and has obvious grass sticking to the stipe base…
it also does not show a clear photo of the veil, partial or otherwise…
nor does it show a clear photo of the stipe, gill attatchment, context and lacks even a spore measurement to boot…
what the photos do show however, is a squamulose pileus…which G. penetrans does not have…according to Murrill…
the mere fact that you people can vote “i’d call it that” on the most controversial of all Gymnopilus species, is just ridiculous…
there is no herbarium specimen, no DNA and absolutely 0 micro…
do as you will.

By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2014-03-04 04:02:40 PST (-0800)

My information
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2013-03-04 22:48:57 PST (-0800)

comes from Funga Nordica (and my own experience).

Funga Nordica reflects the opinion of Knudsen & Vesterholt, and they are using J. Holec as reference to the keys and descriptions.

Anyway, rusty spots and white veil covering young stems, are better identification characters for penetrans.

“Hyphae of upper layer of pileipellis narrow, 3-10(-12) μm; cap principally smooth, but rusty ochre to rusty brown fibrillose-striate or appressed fibrillose-finely scaly, when young covered with white to greyish white tomentose-arachnoid veil; cap flesh pale yellow; young gills pale yellow; stem covered with white tomentose-fibrillose veil remnants. Cap 20-80
(-100) mm, yellow, ochre to rusty brown; gills rusty brown at maturity, often rusty spotted;
stem 20-80(-100) x 3-10(-12) mm, with a whitish, soon disappearing annular zone; taste bitter. Sp 7-9(-9.5) x (4-)4.5-5(5.5) μm, ellipsoid to amygdaloid-ellipsoid, medium verrucose to rugulose-verrucose, without a suprahilar plage, with a slight suprahilar depression (fig. 859F); cheilocystidia cylindrical, narrowly fusiform to lageniform, with an obtuse or subcapitate apex; pleurocystidia rare. On dead wood of coniferous, less frequently broadleaved
trees; summer to late autumn; very common in temp.-bore.”

By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2013-03-04 13:58:42 PST (-0800)

where are you getting this information from?

The cap surface
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2013-03-04 13:14:13 PST (-0800)

on G. penetrans is often equipped with small brown fibrous tufts. It can be even hairier than this.

But I didn’t
By: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)
2013-03-04 11:59:33 PST (-0800)

get your point yet. For example, by your words: it’s said that G. penetrans should have glabrous cap, and this has scales … Ok, suppose microscopy or DNA did on this and everything led us to G. penetrans. What is the function of the scales in the cap (for the mushroom)? Why do some mushrooms have and others do not? Would it be possible any situation with both (with and without scales) in the same species? The same can be said of trama, or cystidia or other… We used to give them different names because those were the available rules, and these rules can change … or not, it’s disconcerting. And here we are, without knowing what the name of this beautiful mushroom, except the genus. (May I call it Richard? rs)
Sorry, but it would be much easier writing in portuguese, I hope you understand my poor english.

By: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)
2013-03-04 11:25:03 PST (-0800)

I didn’t say that I found this particular article funny, it’s all a comment about the writer. In this case I just agree with him, as always.

By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2013-03-04 11:18:24 PST (-0800)

i’m glad you found it funny.
but, it’s a little more than that.

By: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)
2013-03-04 10:23:24 PST (-0800)

Is always a pleasure to read Michael Kuo, moreover, fed me laugh sometimes with him, he surely knows how to make reading easy and fun, and is literally impossible to me to disagree with him.
Now on this observation, I am almost sure that it is G. penetrans / sapineus, (macroscopically speaking, of course). Some grow on stumps, others on branches, pine cones and others apparently on the ground, but I believe they have always wood debris under. This one, for exemple is growing over a small piece of pine bark.
I read that they are spread all over because of the habit of using mulch on gardens to avoid the growth of weeds. I didn’t see any on gardens so far.

check this out…
By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2013-03-01 16:40:55 PST (-0800)
I have been reading
By: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)
2013-03-01 16:25:31 PST (-0800)

this http://www.mycologia.org/content/95/6/1204.full and it is what Alan was referring, I think. Why do you not agree?

By: Elsa (pinknailsgirl)
2013-03-01 16:11:21 PST (-0800)

they are, Richard.

By: Richard Kneal (bloodworm)
2013-03-01 16:08:58 PST (-0800)

are those conifer needles?

Created: 2013-03-01 13:49:00 PST (-0800)
Last modified: 2014-03-04 10:09:47 PST (-0800)
Viewed: 228 times, last viewed: 2017-06-15 09:07:48 PDT (-0700)
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