Observation 142234: Amanita rubescens var. alba Coker
When: 2013-08-09
No herbarium specimen

Notes: Mycorrhizal with birch (left tree in 1st photo perhaps 20’ away).

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Thank you for drying some material for me, Sam.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-08-11 20:57:45 PDT (-0700)

My address is here:

http://www.amanitaceae.org?About+our+editors

Yes, bruising/staining red certainly darkens the cap.

Very best,

Rod

reply to Rod 2
By: Sam.Schaperow (SamSchaperow)
2013-08-11 19:00:21 PDT (-0700)

Hi Rod:

Water soaked is one thing, but if water hits it w/pressure to cause a pinkening, then the cuticle (regardless of how much water makes it into the flesh) can look darker (w/pink to sordid pinkish color), right?

OK, so I went outside to pick them today. I was surprised to find they were drying up. How’d that happen? Is their life-cycle so fast that they’d go from my up-close pictures from yesterday to what I found today w/o disease or other external factors causing this (P1050998.JPG is from earlier today, which while in a basket are how they looked on the ground, for I picked them and pictured them w/in minutes)? As to larvae w/in them, there didn’t appear to be an excess. The gills looked pretty good, though.

Also, I had picked one yesterday that I put in the fridge that was in less dry shape than the outdoor ones. I’m now dehydrating a part of, as well as a part of one of the ones from today. I’ll send them to you. Please send me your address.

Sam Schaperow. M.S.
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/plantforagers/
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/mushroomtalk/
PsychologyCT.com

Thanks for your response, Sam.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-08-10 12:45:32 PDT (-0700)

Yes, water-soaked white looks distinctly grayer than dryer white in terms of amanita flesh.

Yes, the material should be dried (not too high a temperature…say, under 110F) but not too slowly in order to preserve the gill anatomy. Drying in an airconditioned space really speeds things up…as you probably know.

I couple of specimens would be useful. One could be immature, but any others should be dropping spores (but not old).

Thank you, again.

Very best,

Rod

color change & samples
By: Sam.Schaperow (SamSchaperow)
2013-08-10 12:34:38 PDT (-0700)

Could some of the white caps mature to darker color in relation to rains? We’ve had some heavy rain after they surfaced. And being under a tree, they could get pretty inconsistent water beatings, leading some to be darker than others?

Sure, I can dry you some sample. Right, dried? How much do you need, and do you need samples from one mushroom in this cluster, or more than one?

You did understand my reason for the question, Sam.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-08-10 11:46:57 PDT (-0700)

We are at a point in looking at the DNA of the eastern rubescent amanitas at which we realize that initially white specimens can occur in several groups of rubescent taxa that we think we might separate on genetic grounds. This is very preliminary. We have one pair of genes that matches almost all the material I’ve ever called “rubescens var. alba” in the field. We have other pairs of genes which correspond to material that mostly is not white originally, but infrequently is. Again, this is based on a very incomplete analysis of our results, which is going to take some time because we are using field observations, microanatomy,and molecular data to try to create relatively robust species concepts. We have NOT yet analyzed all the morphological data; and, therefore, are not sure whether (and how) we would separate the possible species by morphological methods alone. This doesn’t mean we wont’ sort it out. We just haven’t gotten our hands around all the data. When there is a picture of rubescent amanita on MO that looks as though it may have been entirely white before the staining began, then my interest is aroused. Could you collect and dry some of the mushrooms you depict in this observation? I would be very interested in seeing the material under the microscope and, if possible, getting sequences of the two genes from this material. I’m sure it would be helpful to us.

Very best,

Rod

You know, it is interesting how much whiter some are than others.
By: Sam.Schaperow (SamSchaperow)
2013-08-10 11:35:55 PDT (-0700)

Of the pictures I just uploaded, note the ones showing the top view have one that’s pretty white, but another that isn’t.
And, I’m now looking @ your website and see you classify some as alba with more coloration than I saw on my 1st internet search for alba.
Also, I just saw that I didn’t date today’s as 8/10, so I’ll just say here for all to see that all close-up pictures are from 8/10, but the others are not.

To Rod
By: Sam.Schaperow (SamSchaperow)
2013-08-10 11:24:37 PDT (-0700)

I’m not sure Rod. Are you wondering if they’re var. alba? From what I see online, var. alba is whiter than my photos by a good amount. Now, last year I took the photos from teh same location (see my MushroomTalk post for detail), and I included some good close-up shots of the mushrooms at maybe 1 day less mature: http://foraging4ct.wordpress.com/...

Also, after getting your question, I went out today to take more pictures. I’m noting, though, the new pictures are of more mature specimens that have gained even more color. They will be uploaded here the moment after I send this comment.

Hello, Sam.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-08-09 22:35:18 PDT (-0700)

Were these mushrooms as white as they appear in the photos? Or is that the effect of glare?

Rod

Created: 2013-08-09 18:04:18 PDT (-0700)
Last modified: 2013-08-11 19:28:31 PDT (-0700)
Viewed: 85 times, last viewed: 2016-08-26 21:07:42 PDT (-0700)
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