Observation 143235: Amanita sect. Vaginatae sensu Zhu L. Yang
When: 2013-08-17
Herbarium specimen reported

Notes: This is all I have Dr. T. Drying them now.

Proposed Names

28% (1)
Recognized by sight
7% (2)
Used references
27% (1)
Recognized by sight
54% (1)
Recognized by sight: Placed by molecular study—-nrITS gene derived. See comments.

Please login to propose your own names and vote on existing names.

Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus


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I will keep an eye out for more from this location Dr. T. Cool info. Jon
By: Jon (watchcat)
2015-11-07 17:36:03 CST (-0500)
Rewritten comment.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-11-07 11:56:22 CST (-0500)

[First reported back in May, this is another view of the data.]

It is clearly placed in section Vaginatae; however, it is not very close genetically to any other entity we’ve sequenced in that section. The minimum difference is roughly 15% of the 502 characters in the sequence we obtained. That’s a substantial distance. For those who are surprised by the “short” length of the nrITS sequence, from our short experience (ca. three years) with nrITS in Amanita, sequences in the Vaginatae tend to be shorter than those in other sections of Amanita. There are many taxa that come in at about the same genetic distance. (If it was only a matter of three dimensions, you could imagine your species’ sequence as a star with many other stars the same distance away … points on the surface of a sphere with your “star” in the center.)

Some of the “points on the surface of the sphere” that come out near the top of the list are rhacopus, penetratrix, olivaceogrisea, mortenii, kryorhodon, populiphila, etc. That’s quite a bit of variety there. The number of taxa with graying volva is probably an accident of my interest in the “group” resulting in disproportionately more sequences of the graying volva group in my local data base.

Also, this species is another in the group with the unusual beginning (5’ terminal motif) to the nrLSU gene that I mentioned for A. penetratrix, A.myrmeciae, and a few other taxa recently on MO.

I hope you find this critter again. More data on the fresh mushroom would be of considerable interest.

Very best,


Thanks, Jon.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-27 13:40:47 CDT (-0400)

Very best,


I have shipped that new material today, priority mail.
By: Jon (watchcat)
2015-05-27 09:04:51 CDT (-0400)
Deposits on the stipe…
By: Dave W (Dave W)
2015-05-24 20:04:07 CDT (-0400)

look like UV material that got stuck to the stipe and then broke apart in stages. That it remains white is mysterious.

There’s another possibility.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-24 12:35:40 CDT (-0400)

There are taxa in section Amanita with a saccate volva or with a very narrow bulb and a limbate volva that sometimes looks like a sack in dried material. Mushrooms of these types can cause a lot of trouble when one has only seen pictures and dried specimens. [A reason why thorough, standardized field notes on fresh material can be very, very helpful.] As a guy who has been tricked himself, I can attest to the problem. Amanita murinoflammeum is one example. Amanita pakistanica is a another.

Very best,


sounds like a mystery ….
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2015-05-24 12:12:06 CDT (-0400)

yet to be solved.

Unfortunately, we sent out samples, but have no data.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-23 20:02:59 CDT (-0400)

We’ll make a second try.


By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2015-05-23 18:50:12 CDT (-0400)

what did the DNA tell you about that weird amanita? that is very atypical of our NA caesars, from the warted cap down to the “hard” volva at the base.

what is it with Missouri, anyway? ;)

Hello, Debbie. ..EDIT>>
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-23 14:48:51 CDT (-0400)

There is one North American species of sect. Caesareae with a universal veil that is known to (at least occasionally) separate into warts. It was originally posted on MO. Four (EDIT) of the five (EDIT) known collections are from Missouri. There is also a collection known from Texas. The species is described (from what is known of it) here:


There are three links to MO observations in the “material examined” data field on the techtab of the cited page.

The African material that was reported by Tang et al. was dried material found in Kew. The southeast Asian material is mentioned only very briefly and is apparently known to the authors although not published. No photographs of the ringed species of Vaginatae are provided by Tang et al. I know of no illustrations.

Very best,


it would be very interesting to see …
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2015-05-23 13:31:04 CDT (-0400)

material that is not fully expanded.

those bits of veil on the gills and stipe are suggestive of a partial veil, but what with the heavy warts on the cap, perhaps just transposed UV, instead?

do you have photos of the vaginate amanitas that have PVs, Rod?

I don’t believe that there are any warted caesar’s amanitas (are there?), so that is another way to separate the two amanita sections.

In looking at the photographs again, I see some material on the stipe that looks…
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-23 12:58:39 CDT (-0400)

like a partial veil. That tissue should be checked out. A partial veil is only known from a very small number of species in sect. Vaginatae. These species occur only in Africa and Southeast Asia. They can be distinguished from species of section Caesareae by lack of clamp connections at the bases of basidia and by gene sequences (according to a recent publication in Mycological Progress by Tang et al. earlier this year).

If you find more of this material, it would be very interesting to see if this “ring” is something that is consistently present on the fruiting bodies.

Very best,


Since the topic came up, I played around with the genetic data a little bit. ..EDITED
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-23 12:35:02 CDT (-0400)

The (“right hand”) end of the “proposed fungal barcode” (nrITS) gene is immediately followed in Amanita by a nearly constant string of characters in the “four letter” nucleotide alphabet. You can safely bet that following the nrITS gene you will find TTGACCTCAAATCA. But there are exceptions.

So far in sect. Vaginatae, we have twelve(EDIT) sequences [eleven(EDIT) possible taxa] in which a “C” is inserted between the initial pair of “T’s.” Five of the apparent taxa involved are treated in one way or another on the WAO website: “sp-MN05,” “sp-N49,” “sp-T46,” “sp-V01,” and “albiceps” ( a provisional name of Yves Lamoureux). There is no set of obvious shared characters among these taxa, but they share this odd terminal marker in a region that rarely varies. At the moment this is just a curiosity; however, I thought it was curious enough to mention.

Very best,


We’d love to see your material.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-23 12:02:59 CDT (-0400)

At present we are working against a deadline for sampling material of sect. Amanita. If you have such in hand, we might be able to include it in a shipment if it is received in a week to ten days.

Very best,


Interesting Dr T!
By: Jon (watchcat)
2015-05-23 09:32:33 CDT (-0400)

I have another batch of material btw. It’s from last year.

Hello, Jon.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2015-05-08 16:15:01 CDT (-0400)

A DNA seqence for the “proposed barcode” gene was extracted from your material. It matches no sequences that we previously have found, nor does it match anything posted in GenBank by someone else. It is very likely to be a species of section Vaginatae; however, it is quite distinct from A.texasorora” (formerly “sp-T01”).

We’ll let you know when/if we get further information. Thank you for sending something that is so challenging.

Very best,


Thanks Jon,
By: groundhog
2013-09-13 15:37:08 CDT (-0400)

This material has been received and accessioned into Rod’s herbarium.

If you dried the material did any of the rings on the stem turn color?
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-08-19 14:32:47 CDT (-0400)

I mean: Did the rings on the stem change from white to a distinctly different color?

Do you have a shot of the stem base or of a cross-section of the stem from top to bottom?

Very best,


Interesting! PS…
By: Jon (watchcat)
2013-08-19 12:51:30 CDT (-0400)

I had to look up friable lol. I’ll look at his website for the two you mention. Thank you Debbie. Can’t wait to hear you speak at Mingo! Jon

this is one of the grisettes…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2013-08-19 12:20:43 CDT (-0400)

that has a friable rather than membranous universal veil. You can tell by the warts and obscure volvar material at the base.

Not sure what sp. you have in MO, but it something like inaurata or ceciliae.

Perhaps Rod can shed more light.

Created: 2013-08-19 10:16:01 CDT (-0400)
Last modified: 2015-11-07 23:02:17 CST (-0500)
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