Observation 145497: Amanita sect. Validae (Fr.) Singer

A large collection of specimens that came from at least two unknown collection sites (the last specimen on the right in photo 066 was collected by me on private land just to the southwest of Petit Manan National Wildlife Refuge). Unfortunately, these were bunched together during sorting at Eagle Hill, so there is no way of visually ascertaining if all of these are the same species.

Rod, let me know if you want these. Could this be Amanita sp-N17?

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Thank you, Igor.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-11-08 20:09:43 CET (+0100)

This material has been accessioned in our herbarium.


Please excuse a brief response. Mary and I are both ill.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-10-15 18:06:15 CEST (+0200)

(1) As we get sequencing results, we are posting them on MO and have been doing so for several months.

(2) If you go to the techtab of http://www.amanitaceae.org?Amanita+porphyria and use your browser’s search feature to search for “nrITS,” you will find that all the collections in the “Material Examined” data field that have been sequenced are marked as to which genes were sequenced for the given collection. You can see that multiple western U.S. collections, eastern Canadian collections, and European collections have all been sequenced producing the rssults in my previous post.

With the help of lots of friends who post on MO and others, we are accumulating a goodly sample size of material of porphyria from diverse locations.

I don’t think that this species is the only one with circumpolar distribution. I suggest searching for “circumpolar” on WAO…although I’m not sure you’ll get a complete list of possibilities that way. I think Amanita groenlandica will be one taxon that shows up.


this is very interesting information.
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2013-10-15 17:34:17 CEST (+0200)

Unusual that we have identical material with Europe!

Also true for western porphyria samples?

The DNA just helps us to confirm (or deny) what we are seeing. In my experience, the cap of western porphyria turns silvery gray with age or drying. I have zero experience with eastern porphyria.

When at all possible we should be getting DNA backup on our IDs. Glad that Dr. Hughes is helping with this.

This amanita certainly grossly resembles our concept of porphyria.

This collection has not yet been sampled.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-10-15 17:20:21 CEST (+0200)

On the other hand everything that looked like porphyria and had a graying annulusn no matter how the cap color varied (white to grayish tan to maroon-brown, etc.) and no matter the location in the Northern Hemisphere, has been inseparable from the European porphyria samples for which we have sequences…on the basis of the two genes sequenced (nrITS and nrLSU). Therefore, it is a reasonable hypothesis that the results from the present observation would say that this the mushroom is A, porphyria also. Nevertheless, we will sample the material from this observation and submit the sample to Dr. Hughes.

Very best,


By: I. G. Safonov (IGSafonov)
2013-10-15 04:54:06 CEST (+0200)

If my memory serves right, these stayed brown upon drying. Rod has the samples, so hopefully they will be sent to Dr. Hughes in UTK for sequencing sometime in the future…

did they turn more gray, almost silvery, upon drying?
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2013-10-15 01:21:44 CEST (+0200)

that would indicate porphyria.

Thanks to both Danny and Igor.
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-09-17 18:12:17 CEST (+0200)


re: ret
By: Danny Newman (myxomop)
2013-09-17 17:47:20 CEST (+0200)

the reddishness/brownishness are photographic artifacts. they were much paler/grayer in person. material was dried and is in Igor’s possession. I expect he’ll be sending you some in the near future.

Amanita porphyria and sp-N17 are both possibilities. [Significant change.]
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2013-09-16 20:42:33 CEST (+0200)

The photographs seem a little red for either species; could that be due to indoor lighting or some other artifact?

It’s good that this has come along just at the time when some sequencing of porphyria and similar species is being done.

Hence… Yes I would like to see the dried material.

Very best,


Created: 2013-09-15 20:20:43 CEST (+0200)
Last modified: 2018-01-04 17:09:39 CET (+0100)
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