Observation 196663: Amanita gemmata group
When: 2015-01-18
(35.58° 121.12° 49m)
No herbarium specimen

Notes: Habitat: A few hundred feet in from a coastal bluff under cypress.

Substrate: Cypress duff

Cap: 5 to 13 cm (2" to 5") wide, 1 to 4 cm (1/2" to 1-1/2") high; pale taupe or buff; striated margin; convex becoming to planar in maturity; white to buff warts (not loose on most specimens)

Pores/Gills: white gills; adnexed

Stalk: 5 to 12 cm (2" to 4-1/2") high x 1 to 2 cm (3/8" to 3/4") wide; white; smooth above ring; slightly fibrillose below ring;straight to slightly tapering at the top in mature specimens; snaps like chalk

Spores: white

Additional Notes: A large fruiting growing in a fairy ring below Cypress;
Did not stain after cutting; no discoloration from handling; almost odorless;
Candidates: Parts of description match both Amanita pantherina and Amanita gemmata

Proposed Names

63% (4)
Eye3 Eyes3
Recognized by sight
Used references: Field Guide to Mushrooms of Western North America, mykoweb.com, mushroom expert.com, Mark Brunschwiler, David Krause, Christian Schwarz
41% (3)
Recognized by sight

Please login to propose your own names and vote on existing names.

Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus

Comments

Add Comment
Leaning toward an American version of pantherina
By: Michelle C. Torres-Grant (mctorresgrant)
2015-01-20 10:50:48 CST (-0500)

After reading as much as I had time for I’m now leaning toward the American version associated with A. pantherina. Other than the youngest specimens they were more light brown than yellow and the stipes were definitely white. The volva, however, didn’t exactly match the descriptions I read for either A. gemmata or A. pantherina, but seem closer to A. pantherina. Of course I don’t know for sure, and I’m not very experienced, and even among the experts (the ones I consulted as well as authors whose descriptions I read) were split down the middle on which group they would lump this with…but I’m leaning toward the pantherina group for now. I’m interested if in the future there will be a more official name for this. I am also aware of descriptions such as Amanita pantherinoides …Is it possible it could be something like this?

Hi Michelle
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2015-01-19 19:00:16 CST (-0500)

just the fact of both names being proposed lets folks know that either is possible here.
we don’t really have clear ideas of all of the species involved in both groups, we just seem to use color (brownish, yellowish) as our guide for these purely photo IDs, but even color can be ambiguous.

panthers and gemmata can also grow side by side, so who knows what you have here, exactly?

we can’t claim a hybrid without first delimiting the species. warts can be readily removed in either species, altho that can change a bit in dry conditions.

voting can get rather heated on some of these names … who sez scientists are dispassionate??!

So… either or neither (to be “completely” right, you could always propose Amanita section Amanita, which this is without a doubt, but I think that we can do better than that).

Nothing on MO is set in stone. Feel free to learn as you go along, just like the rest of us have done.

I’m on the fence between Pantherina and Gemmata group
By: Michelle C. Torres-Grant (mctorresgrant)
2015-01-19 18:45:57 CST (-0500)

Thanks for your comments, Debbie ~

I am actually on the fence between the two, and what I really think (based on something I read, perhaps written by you) is that it’s some sort of hybrid… at least they exhibited characteristics of both. There are some more photos here in this set on my web site (apologize for the cell phone quality images): 2015-01-18 Cambria Mushrooms

Most of the specimens were, like you observed, more like pale brown (“Buff” is what came to my mind), but if you look at the youngest specimen I photographed in situ is pale yellow Regarding the warts, on most of the specimens they were rather close and adhering to the cap as opposed to being loose, and that causes me to lean toward A. pantherina So if hybrids between A. pantherina and A. gemmata exist or are at least a possibility is there a way to officially note that, or does one have to pick one or the other? This is the first observation I’ve ever recorded on this web site, so I’m not experienced to know what people do or have done here in this type of situation…must I pick a side, or can I list both and say it’s one or the other, or can I simply call it Amanita and write the two likely candidates in the “Notes” section?

it is equally likely that is it is a panther …
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2015-01-19 18:20:50 CST (-0500)

looks like a pale brown/tan, to me, not a yellow.

but really, who cares? So close, so many are unnamed, it’s a silly hill to die on.

for a while, Desjardin was lumping the two species into one group, so there you are.

take your pick. just don’t eat ’em, regardless of their current “group.”

I will vote for panther though, just to acknowledge that either are possible. It is good that you recognized that they are very close in form, Michelle, because they are.

Created: 2015-01-19 12:44:57 CST (-0500)
Last modified: 2016-04-07 03:01:32 CDT (-0400)
Viewed: 117 times, last viewed: 2016-10-27 09:57:27 CDT (-0400)
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