Observation 46153: Cantharellus cibarius Fr.
When: 2010-05-30
Collection location: St. Genis, France [Click for map]
No herbarium specimen

Notes: Found under mixed hardwoods, mostly oak and hornbeam.

Only 1-2 cm in size. Really pathetic little guys…

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Thanks Daniel
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-06-21 04:52:54 PDT (-0700)

for reminding of this obs!

In Scandinavia this species is called Cantharellus pallens. Here at MO it’s deprecated in favour of cibarius. It sounds like different interpretations of the epithet pallens (there are also albino forms of cibarius, perhaps of pallens too..).
Another name, Cantharellus subpruinosus, is used in France and could refer to this species, and it might be a better choice, if pallens has been misinterpreted by us (can still not find Pilát’s original description).

Dr. Eric Danell
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2010-06-21 00:21:35 PDT (-0700)

did DNA analysis of Cantharellus cibarius back in the early 1990’s. He found C. cibarius has a very limited fruiting area: mostly in Scandinavia (where Fries first collected it), a portion of the Holland coast, and part of English coast, as I recall. Danell did this research after cultivating the original C. cibarius with Pinus seedlings in a greenhouse at Oregon State University. I saw photos of one of the fruiting bodies: coming out of a drainagle hole from a gallon pot with a 5 or 6 inch Pinus seedling. The mushroom was larger than the host plant!

Danell was relying on donated collections of Cantharellus for his research and DNA testing. It is likely he did not receive collections from everywhere. But there is considerable difference via DNA work between the original C. cibarius and what is found outside of Scandinavia. I believe it was a direct result of Danell’s research that showed the PNW Cantharellus, usually just called C. cibarius by Smith and others, had to be re-sorted into multiple species, including C. formosus, the state mushroom of Oregon.

I wish I knew
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-06-02 10:22:53 PDT (-0700)

why it sometimes is important to separate forms of mushrooms as species, and sometimes equally important to separate forms as varieties. What I mean is, if two or more forms do exist without intermediates, why shouldn’t they just as well be separate species?
In this case, it’s not only the colour that differs – also the habitat, different seasons and geographic distribution. C. pallens occurs earlier, with a more southern distribution, and in “nobler” hardwood habitats (oak, hazel, beech etc), not with spruce and rarely with birch, which are the common hosts for cibarius in my area.

Cantharellus sp.
By: zaca
2010-06-02 02:31:42 PDT (-0700)

There’s a big difference between knowing that is not and to know what is. Hopefully, in the meantime, irenea gave a (the) solution.

Cantharellus pallens
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-06-02 00:25:30 PDT (-0700)

is what I call this, with pale caps and stems, and yellow hymenium. I’m not sure what pallens actually was (haven’t managed to find the original description), but we have chosen to use that name, and have a clear concept of this as a species of its own, at least in Scandinavia. Many others have reduced it to a variety of cibarius. I have no idea why(?!) To my knowledge, no substantial DNA work has been done on the “cibarius group”.

???
By: AmatoxinApocalypse (AmatoxinApocalypse)
2010-06-01 22:54:19 PDT (-0700)

They look like very young Cantharellus cibarius to me.

Ok, then what are they?
By: Douglas Smith (douglas)
2010-06-01 21:43:23 PDT (-0700)

Can you point out the features that are different from C. cibarius here, and suggest what they are instead? What other possible mushrooms for the area here would be a better match?

For sure these aren’t Cantharellus cibarius!
By: zaca
2010-06-01 15:30:44 PDT (-0700)

Created: 2010-06-01 08:23:32 PDT (-0700)
Last modified: 2010-06-01 22:54:24 PDT (-0700)
Viewed: 146 times, last viewed: 2016-05-27 06:06:31 PDT (-0700)
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