Observation 52299: Hydnellum peckii Banker
When: 2010-08-08
No herbarium specimen

Proposed Names

74% (2)
Eye3 Eyes3
Recognized by sight
29% (1)
Recognized by sight: I didn’t smell it, but did notice at the time that it looked a bit different from the classic peckii…

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Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus


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Thanks Irene
By: Robert Sasata (Sasata)
2010-10-30 09:48:31 PDT (-0700)

This confirms my suspicions that no-one really knows, and DNA analysis is needed. Now, where are those type specimens….

there you go again, Irene…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2010-10-30 09:37:04 PDT (-0700)

raising the bar with calm facts and fascinating depth. I’d say that the question of whether or not there are indeed two similar red-bleeding species here in North America is currently unresolved.

And I do agree…that DNA analysis of the two varieties could prove very useful…just don’t expect ME to do it! ;)

By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-10-30 05:26:33 PDT (-0700)

does not consider peckii and diabolus to be synonyms. And after all, these are both originally american species, not european – and IndexFungorum reflects european interpretations..!

European authors to blame
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-10-30 05:02:44 PDT (-0700)

European authors have adopted the name Hydnellum peckii for a common european species, and also claimed diabolus to be a synonym. I understand that Maas Geesteranus had a large impact on that, being the leading european expert on toothed mushrooms, but he studied mushrooms in herbariums – with the microscope, but without much experience of field mycology.
His “Die terrestrischen Stachelpilze Europas” (1975) is often referred to, but I haven’t seen the book, and don’t know if he ever mentioned diabolus, or just used the name peckii for one single species with acrid taste, and others drawing the conclusion from that, that diabolus was a synonym..?

Pouzar, a czech mycologist, hasn’t agreed on the broad concept of peckii, though.

I’m not alone to have noticed that we seem to have at least two different taxa in Scandinavia as well, but they haven’t been investigated. We still call them peckii here, only identified by their acrid taste:

1. small, with a bumpy cap surface and conical shape, found with both Picea and Pinus (peckii – or similar?)
2. large and persistantly fibrous, with broad, flattened caps and a short but well defined stem, often with a longer and soft pseudostem below, with Pinus (diabolus – or similar?)

This would be a perfect example for comparing existing DNA-sequences..

By: Danny Newman (myxomop)
2010-10-30 04:27:41 PDT (-0700)

the difference was largely based on smell; a less than major factor in the differentiation of one species from another. If I.F. lists the two as synonymous, the case is closed as far as I’m concerned.

By: Robert Sasata (Sasata)
2010-10-29 18:56:46 PDT (-0700)

Can anyone point me to a source that claims synonymy between H. peckii and H. diabolum? Contrary to Index Fungorum’s claim, I didn’t find any concrete evidence to support this in my recent research.

as to the other “peckii” photos…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2010-10-29 14:52:53 PDT (-0700)

I fear that these tough, toothed fungi need a bit more close examination as well…the macro is just not giving us enough details to go on, and I sincerely doubt that anyone put these under the scope, if that would even be helpful, I know that I didn’t…

yes, I saw that they were current synonyms…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2010-10-29 14:45:24 PDT (-0700)

altho they do look different, and apparently a sweet odor in “diabolus” (love the name, even if it is deprecated) is an interesting difference as well.
does the DNA match in the two forms?

somebody had to ask…;)

By: Danny Newman (myxomop)
2010-10-29 14:20:43 PDT (-0700)

between H. diabolus and H. peckii rules out having to distinguish between the two. The red exudate is there, as it is in Dan Wheeler’s very similar Oregon observation: http://mushroomobserver.org/27563. Your two observations and Daniel’s one appear to be intermediate stages between the classic “Strawberries and Cream” look and these three older Hydnellum spp. listed as H. peckii


… if they are all in fact H. peckii.

my point, exactly! ;)
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2010-10-29 08:16:34 PDT (-0700)
appears to be the same
By: Danny Newman (myxomop)
2010-10-29 02:21:22 PDT (-0700)

Created: 2010-09-07 22:19:12 PDT (-0700)
Last modified: 2010-10-30 09:37:45 PDT (-0700)
Viewed: 132 times, last viewed: 2016-10-26 18:08:23 PDT (-0700)
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