Observation 59556: Tricholoma manzanitae T.J. Baroni & Ovrebo
When: 2010-11-22
No herbarium specimen

Notes: Caps 3-4" across, viscid. No odor.

[admin – Tue Feb 08 12:35:08 +0000 2011]: Changed location name from ‘Willits, Mendocino Co., California, USA’ to ‘Willits, California, USA

Proposed Names

-56% (8)
Recognized by sight
-84% (8)
Recognized by sight
44% (8)
Recognized by sight
-15% (4)
Recognized by sight: for want of a better name/genus.

Please login to propose your own names and vote on existing names.

Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus

Comments

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I haven’t checked CA Fungi for the photo…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-02-06 16:08:51 UTC (+0000)

but DB’s photo is obviously of some older, somewhat beat-up material. No wonder it was tough to put a name to it! And no wonder Christian didn’t think that these two were the same mushroom…

All books have a few errors. We just need to work with them and around them, as best we can. Forums like this are very useful for highlighting what is important and what is not, and sharing hard won knowledge.

2,000+ members and counting! :) I heart MO.

Very nice photo of T. manzanitae
By: Dimitar Bojantchev (dimitar)
2011-02-05 22:07:52 UTC (+0000)

That same discussion on Tricholoma manzanitae took place at the MSSF Mushroom Fair id session 2009 in the presence of Dennis Desjardin and Mike Wood. These photos where taken then – Tricholoma manzanitae
the distinct brown bruising almost suggested a brown spored group. Anyway, the photo in the Agaricales of CA is WRONG represents T. dryophilum. T. manzanitae is a rare mushroom and this is why that wrong photo went unnoticed for a while.

Errors
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-04 16:20:00 UTC (+0000)

Yes, that photo doesn’t look the original description’s photo, and is surrounded by oak, not manzanita leaves.

Errors
By: Darvin DeShazer (darv)
2011-02-04 03:10:31 UTC (+0000)

The Agaricales of California, Tricholoma photos 11:30 (Tricholoma manzanitae) and 11:44 (Tricholoma ustale) are both Tricholoma dryophilum. Beware – there are also other errors in the photos for that chapter!

About face
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-04 02:35:35 UTC (+0000)

Although the colors gave me pause, I agree that T. manzanitae is a very good option.
Thanks for the correction on the habitat – and for the link for those without access to the original description.

Nice sleuthing the tnihekr and Debbie.

here’s the original description…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-02-04 02:04:09 UTC (+0000)

http://www.cybertruffle.org.uk/...

that appears to be quite inclusive of both the habitat under which this particular mushroom was collected (NOT exclusive to Arctostaphylus) as well as discussing variation in cap color, staining of cap, gills, etc. Gills can indeed turn yellowish with age. Perhaps CA Fungi showed an older version of this mushroom species?

even the spore size shape etc. is spot on.

My only qualms
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-04 01:51:26 UTC (+0000)

With T. manzanitae are these:

1) It wasn’t strictly with Arctostaphylos… it was with madrone. I know that is a very neglible difference, but obviously the authors thought the association was important enough to put it in the name.

2) More importantly, the description mentions that the mushroom RAPIDLY develops orange to orange-brown and eventually brown tones on the cap. These mushrooms ain’t got that color.

2) Mike Woods’ photo in Agaricales of CA shows a much more robust mushroom with yellowish gills.

That said, the spore size is in the same range (but so are lots of white-spored things), and the description/habitat match reasonably well.

At the very least, my vote goes to Tricholoma.

Nice call, the tnihekr.

as per suggestion by recent poster…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-02-04 01:37:17 UTC (+0000)

T. manzanitae has the right coloration, habitat, viscidity, even that bit of reddish blush on the stipe as well as granules at the apex.
white spores, elliptical, smooth…need I go on?

could it be
By: jimmiev
2011-02-03 23:41:20 UTC (+0000)
more micro
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-03 22:23:27 UTC (+0000)

Spores inamyloid, ellipsoid, 6-7 × 4-6 microns, smooth
Clamps absent.
Probably not a Leucopaxillus

I would call
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-03 21:22:41 UTC (+0000)

the gills deeply notched, not free.
Also, the cap margin is ribbed – a good sign for Leucopax

hmmm
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2011-02-03 20:19:19 UTC (+0000)

Cap viscid,
Stalk, slightly powdery, tough,
spore print white,
Gills free!

That rules out Rhodocollybia, Melanoleuca, “most” Leucopaxillus sp etc
However Tricholoma can have both free gills, white spores, and viscid cap….

But it doesn’t quite look like Tricholoma….

Clitocybe are said to be rarely viscid (Arora)

(this is getting me really curious!)

Check those spores out please… :D

Shifted world axis
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-03 19:43:47 UTC (+0000)

Although the evidence doesn’t look good right now, the world hasn’t shifted on it’s axis. As Walt and Noah have already mentioned, and as Funga Nordica reiterates, there are some slightly viscid species (it had been raining a lot, if I recall Noah’s description) and smooth, weakly amyloid spored species.

Having seen this thing in person a month later, it had the Leucopaxillus gestalt – mostly textural, but look at the base of the stipe, too…

Gimme a couple hours, more micro on a better scope to see if I can get better idea of spore amyloidity and see if I can rustle up some clamps.

Clitocybe/Lepista
By: Noah Siegel (Noah)
2011-02-03 19:33:52 UTC (+0000)

would be my second guess after Leucopaxillus

A bit like …
By: Patrick Harvey (pg_harvey)
2011-02-03 19:11:53 UTC (+0000)

Lepista irina? Not real confident of this, but looks kind of similar

Tricholoma, why not?
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2011-02-03 18:55:28 UTC (+0000)

Cap viscid,
Stalk, slightly powdery, tough,
spore print white,
Gills free!

That rules out Rhodocollybia, Melanoleuca, Leucopaxillus, etc
However Tricholoma can have both free gills, white spores, and viscid cap….

but this mushroom doesn’t look a thing like L. lepistoides…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-02-03 18:37:15 UTC (+0000)

a rare mushroom from Europe as well as perhaps Africa, and with a blazing white non-viscid cap and crenate gills. I still don’t buy Leucopax as a genus. Too many reasons why not, and shaky evidence to try and make it so.

Even if it looked like the darned thing (and it doesn’t), it is very rare for the west coast to share species with Europe…that’s an eastern thing.

Where was that “similar species” from North America collected?

Here are a few photo links to L. lepistoides:

http://picsdeniza.eu/image/324a1617/

http://mushroomhobby.com/...

More microscopy, please.

You know a FEW Leucopax…
By: Noah Siegel (Noah)
2011-02-03 18:12:18 UTC (+0000)

like Walt said a few Leucopaxillus have viscid caps and all in section Asporpaxilli have smooth spores, some of which are only slightly amyloid.

That being said, using Singer and Smith’s “A monograph on the genus Leucopaxillus” it doesn’t key out… the closest it keys to is Leucopaxillus lepistoides; which was described from African. BUT they mention a single North American collection that matches microscopically.

Leucopaxillus
By: walt sturgeon (Mycowalt)
2011-02-03 17:07:33 UTC (+0000)

Can be slightly viscid but this one does look more than slightly…

um, has the world shifted its axis and nobody told me??!
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-02-03 16:42:42 UTC (+0000)

Leucopax has a DRY cap and amyloid, ornamented spores. I know Leucopax, and this is no Leucopax (to paraphrase Lloyd Bensen re: Dan Quail and JFK; you young ’uns may not get the reference…).

How about Rhodocollybia ?
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2011-02-03 16:22:25 UTC (+0000)

or are the spores different,
what shape size where the spores?

Melanoleuca with a viscid cap?
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2011-02-03 16:00:51 UTC (+0000)

Not likely,

Looks like a cross between Lactarius and Hygrophorus :D

Micro
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2011-02-03 08:27:38 UTC (+0000)

No clamps found, will check again tomorrow.
Along with smooth spores and viscid cap all suggest against Leucopaxillus.

Leucopaxillus has free gills?
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2011-02-03 03:27:10 UTC (+0000)
dude…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-02-03 03:12:00 UTC (+0000)

go to the scope!

The gills
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-11-24 07:32:13 UTC (+0000)

look typical for Tricholoma.

Checking spores in the microscope should tell if it’s Leucopaxillus (spiny/verrucose spores with amyloid ornamentation)

it has
By: Noah Siegel (Noah)
2010-11-24 06:44:29 UTC (+0000)

white spores, a really tough stipe and no taste

Interesting
By: Christian (Christian Schwarz)
2010-11-24 02:54:06 UTC (+0000)

did you definitely rule out Hebeloma?
Is there a spore print going?

Created: 2010-11-24 02:08:25 UTC (+0000)
Last modified: 2016-06-18 02:33:39 UTC (+0000)
Viewed: 508 times, last viewed: 2016-09-21 02:38:10 UTC (+0000)
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