Observation 67512: Morchella snyderi M. Kuo & Methven
When: 2011-05-14
No herbarium specimen

Notes: morels were sparse.

Proposed Names

28% (7)
Recognized by sight: growing in sunny location along creek, area rich in elk dung.
3% (6)
Recognized by sight: Based on location of find, and personal collecting from the area. This is the classic Oregon “Burn site” morel, which actually only needs a little disturbance to fruit.
-90% (2)
Recognized by sight
-86% (1)
Recognized by sight
-9% (2)
Recognized by sight: Morphologically indistinguishable from other black morels in this habitat

Please login to propose your own names and vote on existing names.

Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus

Comments

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Would be nice to see the stem
By: Terri Clements/Donna Fulton (pinonbistro)
2017-05-01 16:05:33 PDT (-0700)

and to know about the trees in the area. It certainly could be M. snyderi but I don’t see enough info here to tell.

BTW Terri
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2017-04-15 16:21:19 PDT (-0700)

this is certainly not eohespera, either. Beug just shared his photos of it with me.

Eohespera looks just like Mel-8, small and slender, but occurs at a different time.

This is clearly snyderi, but this battle of the morels is no longer about seeking truth, methinks.

in case you need more evidence
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2017-04-12 09:29:33 PDT (-0700)

snyderi commonly grows in clusters under conifers, just like these shown here.

both eohespera and brunnea, its lookalike, fruit singly or sometimes in sm. groupings; brunnea and Mel-8 (AS IF!) fruit under hardwoods (Darv’s collection was under mixed trees, within an old apple orchard plus an incense cedar above).

highly unlikely to be either of those two barely known sp.
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2017-04-12 09:05:04 PDT (-0700)

Mel-8 was found in Darvin’s backyard in Sebastopol. Can’t find other examples from anywhere else, but it is a small, slender, mostly straight stiped morel, similar to brunnea, not stocky like snyderi. To my knowledge, it hasn’t even been published yet!

Mel-19 is a far northern species. Think Newfoundland and extreme N. WA. Very few records of this in the US (one, from N. WA), and it was possibly introduced from Asia (where the vast majority of samples have been found). It also fruits much later in the season … July vs May. It is far removed from snyderi genetically, and bears no resemblance to it.

These are natural black morels, with a stocky shape. Snyderi is still by far the most likely ID.

Guess your current designation is better than Ascomycota, but not by much.

In an unbiased vote, snyderi would have to be at least promising.

But who ever said MO was unbiased?

Could also be Mel-8 or Mel-19 (M.eohespera)
By: Terri Clements/Donna Fulton (pinonbistro)
2017-04-12 07:56:00 PDT (-0700)

which occur across the continent. We do have a name for this obs: Morchella sect. Distantes.

well, if we keep on pulling “cryptic species”
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2017-04-12 07:49:28 PDT (-0700)

out of our hats, we will never be able to safely put a specific name to any of our morels!

still and all, snyderi is surely the most likely species here. none of “your” AZ morel sp. which is a dead ringer for snyderi, has been confirmed for CA.

239180

in a reasoned argument, snyderi would be the one to have to disprove. It is certain the most likely species shown here, and commonly collected all along the west coast in montaine hab.

It is not practical to run DNA on every morel we find.

I think it is the other way around
By: Terri Clements/Donna Fulton (pinonbistro)
2017-04-12 07:33:30 PDT (-0700)

You were as confident that obs 239180 was snyderi but it turned out to be something else entirely tho it had all of the morphological and ecological characters.

cmon Terri
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2017-04-12 06:49:12 PDT (-0700)

you are grasping at straws here!

M. snyderi, bless its pocked little head, is one of the rare black non-burn morels that can be readily IDed just by its macro.

these are classic examples.

I went thru all of my older morel obsies last night, in prep for my talk to the OMS next week. Some morels are indeed a mystery; these are not.

morel names
By: BlueCanoe
2012-04-13 14:32:24 PDT (-0700)

I agree that there remains quite a bit of difficulty in identifying morels short of DNA, and some are still impossible, but the O’Donnell et al. 2011 paper was focused on molecular phylogeny more than formal taxonomy. The new Kuo et al. 2012 paper (also co-authored by O’Donnell) goes a lot further in terms of field identification.

ah, the morel name game: like kids with a new toy!
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2012-04-13 14:03:26 PDT (-0700)

One of the main points of the below recent major morel paper is…that beyond whether one has a blonde or black or wood-chip rufobrunnea in hand…you CAN’T tell it to species by just looking. the paper cites only two exceptions to that rule: the distinct, ladder-like pits of Morchella tomentosa and the yellow morel M. steppicola from the Balkans.

All others can only be known in hand to their clades, i.e., either the elata clade (blacks) or the esculenta clade (blondes).

So sure, this is a Morchella… but as a black morel, the best name would be Morchella (elata clade). No argument, I hope, that this is either a blonde or rufobrunnea. It was also NOT growing on a burn, not that that really makes much of a difference.

Quote below.

From the “Phylogeny and historical biogeography of true morels…”O’Donnel et al

“Not surprisingly, their extreme morphological
stasis has contributed to the enormous taxonomic confusion
within this genus. Morels, for example, can easily be identified
as members of the Esculenta (yellow morels) or Elata (black morels)
Clades, but only one species within each clade (Mes-1 = M. steppicola
and Mel-1 = M. tomentosa) can be distinguished currently using phenotypic
data.”

LOL me too
By: Charles Seltenright Sr (Shroomin Yooper)
2011-05-20 03:50:11 PDT (-0700)
well, I guess that it’s a change of pace…
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2011-05-18 09:54:13 PDT (-0700)

to be fighting over morel names rather than amanitas! think that i’ll sit this one out…I called ’em “delicious” when I ate them last night. ;)

Created: 2011-05-16 20:05:07 PDT (-0700)
Last modified: 2017-05-01 16:57:35 PDT (-0700)
Viewed: 269 times, last viewed: 2017-06-09 10:20:42 PDT (-0700)
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