Observation 71269: Amanita sect. Caesareae Singer
When: 2011-07-09
Herbarium specimen reported

Proposed Names

45% (4)
Recognized by sight
ret
42% (5)
Eye3
Based on microscopic features: Despite this specimen having small spores as dried, they are still proportionately narrower than those of A. jacksonii and more similar to those of Amanita sp-S10. This data is further discussed and expanded in the comments, below.
58% (2)
Eyes3
Recognized by sight: The other Amanita (sect.) Caesareae name has the parenthesis in a nonstandard place, causing it to show up twice when it should only show up once. This name has the parenthesis in the standard place. It is desirable to have the parenthesis in the correct place so all sect. Caesarere observations are displayed together.
Used references: Rod Tulloss said: Despite this specimen having small spores as dried, they are still proportionately narrower than those of A. jacksonii and more similar to those of Amanita sp-S10. This data is further discussed and expanded in the comments, below.

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Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus

Comments

Add Comment
Patrick
By: John McDonough
2014-05-01 11:55:57 CDT (-0400)

it appears that we may be on the same trail…..again:)

http://mushroomobserver.org/141816?q=1uTub

John

Stressed
By: Patrick Harvey (pg_harvey)
2011-07-28 10:54:46 CDT (-0400)

Heat’s been bad here this year, like all over. We had a recent rain there that popped a lot of things up, but they still got roasted afterwards. Hope we get some more precip. soon so I can find more interesting things.

71265 is _banningiana
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2011-07-27 20:23:51 CDT (-0400)

The point was just that, for some reason, two collections from 9 July 2011 from Hawn St. Pk., both seemed to have been rather stressed fruiting bodies before they were dried. That’s all.

R.

By: Patrick Harvey (pg_harvey)
2011-07-27 12:25:50 CDT (-0400)

Is that observation also S10, or should that comment appear here?

Thanks,
Patrick

spores from near the cap edge…
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2011-07-26 16:56:06 CDT (-0400)

Well, it was worthwhile looking at the spores again as I mentioned. I did find larger (and probably more typical) spores; nevertheless, the specimen seems to have gotten a bit old and dry before it went into the dryer. I decided I had to believe my own data and added the collection to the material of the techtab on the WAO page for Amanita sp-S10. So now that species is represented by a collection that was too young and a collection that was too old. Not an ideal situation; so if you (or anyone else reading this!) can find another collection, I will be delighted to add it (them?) into the process of getting a better grip on this brilliant colored critter.

Very best,

R.

Re: SP-S10
By: Patrick Harvey (pg_harvey)
2011-07-26 14:53:14 CDT (-0400)

Hi Rod,

Thanks for your assessment of this one. We found about 3 of them that day, including a button, but someone else either got them or we “recycled.” I put
a question to our MOMS Facebook group to see if someone actually kept and dried
one of them.

It’s been awful dry here lately, but I may be able to get down there some time after the next rain to see if any more have come up. Probably late on a weekday, going up to Normal, IL instead this weekend. I’ll let you know.

— Patrick

The spores…
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2011-07-26 10:59:20 CDT (-0400)

The spores are proportionately narrower than those of A. jacksonii. Considering the color distribution on the cap and the spores, I’m inclinded to say that this is not A. jacksonii. I’m going to spend a little more time looking at spores from the gills near the cap edge because these mature last, and I am hoping that I might find some “closer to typical” spores in this region.

Unfortunately, the range of spore size is very small and the hoped-for “bell curve” shape of the distribution of spore length is truncated…indicating that there would have been larger values of length, but that something (probably age of the basidiome prior to drying) affected the spore size, which is abnormal. This creates a problem for determination because the “original” collection of sp-S10 was apparently immature and bears “giant” spores. Hence, if the two collections belong to a single species, neither are typical in terms of spore size and shape distribution. Headache. Patrick, I hope you find another collection. If you can get a spore print and then dry the specimen as quickly as possible, it’s possible for us to make some progress on understanding sp-S10.

Very best,

R.

Going to check it shortly…
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2011-07-25 16:19:14 CDT (-0400)

Patrick sent the specimen, which arrived while I was out of the country. I’ve just finished two of the specimens he sent (A. spreta) and will try this one next.

R.

By: damon brunette (damonbrunette)
2011-07-25 15:44:43 CDT (-0400)

Yes…. Was thinking ol’ S10….

Amanita sp-S10
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2011-07-25 12:20:58 CDT (-0400)

…is possible:

www.amanitaceae.org/?Amanita sp-S10

R.

Not sure…
By: R. E. Tulloss (ret)
2011-07-25 12:15:47 CDT (-0400)

about jacksonii in this case. We’ve been getting a bicolor taxon like this for several years from the general area of the SE states of the U.S. More in a bit.

R.

Created: 2011-07-09 20:20:51 CDT (-0400)
Last modified: 2016-10-24 02:08:06 CDT (-0400)
Viewed: 268 times, last viewed: 2016-10-24 02:08:06 CDT (-0400)
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