Observation 9606: Daldinia Ces. & De Not.
When: 2008-08-18
Who: apgarm
No herbarium specimen

Notes: Found on hardwood log (possibly elm) that was felled ~5 years ago. Log diameter ~14 cm lying on overgrown grassy area shaded by Beech tree.

Sizes range from 1 to 4 cm.
Extremely hard.

[admin – Sat Aug 14 02:07:57 +0000 2010]: Changed location name from ‘Windsor, CT’ to ‘Windsor, Connecticut, USA

Proposed Names

-16% (2)
Eye3
Recognized by sight: See comments
56% (1)
Eyes3
Used references: “The D. concentrica group comprises the type species and several related taxa that are typically distributed in mild temperate and subtropical climates of western and southern Europe; some related taxa occur in tropical Africa and in the Southern Hemisphere. They have so far not been found in the Americas and the temperate regions of Asia, despite diligent search. All previous records of “D. concentrica“ from Asia and America obviously need to be revised.” http://www.studiesinmycology.org/...

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Eye3 = Observer’s choice
Eyes3 = Current consensus

Comments

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Looks like a possible ash
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2009-06-06 22:59:51 CEST (+0200)

I agree, there are other possible species than concentrica with concentric zones and growing on different substrates. I also agree that chemical tests and checking spores is essential, but is there anything that speaks against grandis, the one that looks like the closest by appearance?

Here is a list of species:
http://mycology.sinica.edu.tw/...

Not restricted to Ash
By: Neil
2009-06-06 22:31:08 CEST (+0200)

This could well be Ash, but D. concentrica can be found also on Fagus, Aesculus, Betula and Sorbus.
If the Betula is burnt, then the Cramp Ball is likely to be D. loculata.
Other species (7 in Britain) of Daldinia have concentric zones, and I shall reiterate that I do not recognise those shown in the photo as D. concenrica with those prominent ‘stalks’ showing.
EDIT: On Ulmus it could be D. grandis and on burnt gorse probably D. fissa or even D.caldariorum, but as the previous post say’s YOU CANNOT IDENTIFY SPECIES BY IT"S HOST, the pigments have to be looked at (colour) as well as other microscopic features.

You cannot
By: Gerhard Koller (Gerhard)
2009-06-06 22:28:22 CEST (+0200)

distinguish Daldinia species by substrate … you have to take a look under the scope and watch for the color pigments in KOH first, then at the spores (of course) and there are some other features too … there’s a key for European species in the German mycological journal 2001 I think but no other is known to me unfortunately…

Could the host be Fraxinus?
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2009-06-06 22:00:15 CEST (+0200)

Ash is a common host for Daldinia concentrica – I don’t know if any other Daldinia species prefers elm.

For the record…
By: apgarm
2009-06-06 19:57:56 CEST (+0200)

The log is not maple, I believe it is elm but if the species needs positive identification, I can get that.

I still have half of a dried specimen from that time.

I just checked the log and there are still a few there (although they don’t look great) so if a fresh specimen is required I can get some.

Are there any pictures that could help, please let me know.

Stem
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2009-06-06 19:29:58 CEST (+0200)

Looks as though it could be growing on a maple log which has already lost most of its bark. When Daldinia grows on maple, it assists in denuding the log of any residual bark, which typically does not last more than a year after death anyway.
Extreme hardness of Daldinia does not occur until the fungus is quite mature. I have collected very fresh Daldinia growing on what were supposed to be shiitake bed logs which were quite soft and pleasantly aromatic within 3 days of erupting from the bark.
Unless you are specifically looking for fungi on logs, Daldinia frequently escapes detection until it is quite mature.

By: Shane Marsh (Mushane)
2009-06-06 17:20:13 CEST (+0200)

yeah this isnt grandis, interesting growth though, and concentrica looks like it fits if theres concentric rings.
did you measure the spores?
that extended stem system is a bit strange though, ive never seen any daldinia showing this kind of growth before.

Daldinia sp.
By: Neil
2009-06-06 14:06:12 CEST (+0200)

As far as I know, D.concentrica does not have these clearly defined ‘stems’ as shown in the photo.

Daldinia concentrica
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2008-08-19 06:35:19 CEST (+0200)

Concentric rings equal D. concentrica. Now you know what that species name stands for.

I’ll buy Daldinia…
By: apgarm
2008-08-19 00:56:07 CEST (+0200)

I have sliced one open and there are definitely what look like growth rings. I made a longitudinal cut on one of the smaller ones (14mm wide x 20mm tall). What would I look for to get to species? I can get a picture up tomorrow of the inside if that will help.

Daldinia
By: Daniel B. Wheeler (Tuberale)
2008-08-18 23:37:45 CEST (+0200)

Look like Daldinia, either D. concentrica or D. grandis; aka King Alfred’s Cakes. Would have to cut one thru the center to be sure.

Created: 2008-08-18 21:18:30 CEST (+0200)
Last modified: 2014-07-15 01:24:41 CEST (+0200)
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