Observation 48226: Pluteus Fr.

When: 2010-07-04

Collection location: Sherman Creek Rd., Montana, USA [Click for map]

Who: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)

Specimen available

This is an immature specimen

[admin – Sat Aug 14 02:00:20 +0000 2010]: Changed location name from ‘Eureka MT Area USA’ to ‘near Eureka, Montana, USA

Species Lists


Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes (Johann) Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes (Johann) Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes (Johann) Harnisch
Copyright © 2010 Johannes (Johann) Harnisch

Proposed Names

48% (4)
Recognized by sight
-28% (1)
Recognized by sight: Same color as P cervinus found on deciduous wood,
Used references: Agarics and Boleti by Meinard Moser,
Based on microscopic features: Cystidia without horns
-51% (3)
Recognized by sight: Robust Pluteus species with a dark cap
Based on microscopic features: Spores eliptical, cystidia with horns
31% (2)
Recognized by sight: Clamps in Cysitdia

Please login to propose your own names and vote on existing names.

= Observer’s choice
= Current consensus


Add Comment
several clamped species in this section of the genus
By: else
2010-12-09 19:30:48 GMT (+0000)

it is never as simple as it looks. there are several species with clamps in Pluteus sect. Pluteus (the species with the thick-walled, horned pleurocystidia). and it seems that they are not really quite sorted out, a bit in Europe, but not in North America. in short it can be something else than P. pouzarianus.

cervinus and pouzarianus
By: Michael Wood (mykoweb)
2010-12-09 18:05:50 GMT (+0000)

From the California Fungi description of P. pouzarianus (http://www.mykoweb.com/CAF/species/Pluteus_pouzarianus.html):

“It is not known how common Pluteus pouzarianus is in California, since it would usually be misidentified in the field as Pluteus cervinus. Macroscopically the only differences are the slightly greyer cap of Pluteus pouzarianus, the usual lack of a raphanoid smell, and its growth on coniferous wood rather than the hardwoods that Pluteus cervinus inhabits. With the aid of a microscope we can see that Pluteus pouzarianus, in contrast to Pluteus cervinus, has clamp connections in the pileipellis which is a cutis of two layers, a hyaline layer over a brown pigmented layer.”

Or see Else Vellinga’s description in FAN:

Bas, C., Kuyper, T.W., Noordeloos, M.E. & Vellinga, E.C. (1990). Flora Agaricina Neerlandica — Critical monographs on the families of agarics and boleti occuring in the Netherlands. Volume 2. Pleurotaceae, Pluteaceae, Tricholomataceae. A. A. Balkema: Rotterdam, Netherlands. 137 p.

Or Singer’s protologue (which I have not seen):

Singer, R. (1983). Weiss-und rosasporige Agaricales (Tricholomataceae und Pluteaceae) österreich. Sydowia 36: 277-287.

Yeah that is what I thought Irene
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2010-12-09 15:40:21 GMT (+0000)

I will have to check the herbarium specimen

By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-12-09 08:28:27 GMT (+0000)

differs from cervinus only by clamps in the hyphae of the cap surface, and preferring coniferous wood and litter.

Btw, thanks to both Johannes and Douglas for advice about camera settings!

could be, do they not have horns as big?
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2010-12-09 03:31:50 GMT (+0000)
P. pouzarianus
By: Jimmie Veitch (jimmiev)
2010-12-09 03:23:55 GMT (+0000)

is P. pouzarianus possible?

Yeah, I do that…
By: Douglas Smith (douglas)
2010-07-09 15:01:48 BST (+0100)

Yeah, that is what I do, I don’t have a camera mount either. Actually with my scope on 100x I have to turn the light down, at 400x the light is somewhere in the middle, and at 1000x the light has to be turned all the way up.

Also try to force your camera to full aperture open, use the lowest f-stop number to get a wider field of view.

For the focus I’ve found it is quicker to not allow the auto-focus of the camera, but to put the camera on manual focus at 25-30cm. That seems to work best with the scope through the eye-piece, and gives a consistent shot. Since I usually take 2-10 shots per mount when I am at the scope.

I use gimp to edit the photos, that gives you more than picasa, and also an easy download.

Actually now I got tired of wasting time setting levels on so many photos, I wrote a program that uses image magic to calculate the histogram and determine the levels for the photo and sets them for me. Since I usually have to process 10-200 photos at a time… but maybe you don’t need to go that crazy…

But yeah, camera mounts and special equipment is over-rated. Digital camera, eye-piece, shoot… works fine.

Oh one more thing
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2010-07-09 14:39:38 BST (+0100)

after I adjusted the image to be in focus I turned the lighting on the microscope all the way up so that I can use a higher shutter speed to avoid blurr, also be sure to turn the flash off on the camera.

By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2010-07-09 13:58:18 BST (+0100)

Yeah I guess I got that idea (wrinkled dark pilius) from David Arora’s book MD.

What I do is just as simple as getting the specimen in focus then I set my DSLR camera to Manual focus zoom in all the way and hold it just slightly above the eye piece thing you look through, I take the pictures that way, then I auto adjust the
lighting (highlights shadows etc) and wight balance with Picasa.
you can down load it Picasa free it is really neat you can also edit your picture size and do crops with it.

Please tell
By: Irene Andersson (irenea)
2010-07-09 12:02:07 BST (+0100)

how you get the micro shots!

PS, dark and wrinkled cap is not a feature in Pluteus magnus according to the description in Sylloge Fungorum
Here’s the type collection:

Yes I was looking at those horns
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2010-07-08 01:55:02 BST (+0100)

or may be we should call them antlers and they grow with age??
this was an immature specimen LOL
And thanks for the link.
PS did I tell you how I get those pictures?
I don’t have a camera mount either

link to magnus micrograph
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2010-07-07 16:58:02 BST (+0100)
nice micrograph Johann.
By: Debbie Viess (amanitarita)
2010-07-07 16:43:52 BST (+0100)

I haven’t looked at a lot of Pluteus cystidia, but the one pictured does seem to have a discrete pair of horns, like Pan vs Texas longhorn.

Okay thanks for that imfo
By: Johannes Harnisch (Johann Harnisch)
2010-07-07 13:43:40 BST (+0100)

I will be adding macro pics soon

Except -
By: Douglas Smith (douglas)
2010-07-07 08:45:06 BST (+0100)

Except for the fact that P. magnus has pointed cystidia, not rounded. With these cystidia I think you have proven that these are not P. magnus. With what is given here, not sure you’ve shown that this is even Pluteus?

From the literature, it seems that P. magnus should be a rare species, in the studies it doesn’t get listed much, with not many samples studied from herbariums (herbaria?). Somehow the name is getting used often here, and I not completely sure why.

If it is the wrinkled caps, I think that the descriptions of P. cervinus, and other related species, include wrinkled caps when young. So, not sure if that is a good feature.

Since the name gets used often enough here, it seems like there are enough people with scopes now that quick shots of the fresh bodies can be included with shots of the cystidia, to see if they are pointed or with hooks.

Nice shots of cystidia though…

Created: 2010-07-07 03:15:59 BST (+0100)
Last modified: 2011-02-01 18:10:18 GMT (+0000)
Viewed: 391 times, last viewed: 2019-02-04 13:25:43 GMT (+0000)
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